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03 VW GTI code 17544 P1136

posted Jul 10, 2016 19:33:24 by Josh R
This VW has a Fuel Trim Bank 1 System to lean code. The vw code being 17544 and the p code p1136.
I put a smoke machine on her to see if there are any vacuum leaks. Not a single one was found, also used the water bottle trick, to no avail. The next thing i did was to put a scanner on and get 02 sensor voltage while hot. I need help reading the graphs, please.

Does the book that Paul puts out help interpret graphs and whats out of range and why it maybe that way. I'm self taught and lucky enough to afford nice tools but I lack the knowledge of being able to interpret the data.
Josh
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15 replies
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Dylan said Jul 10, 2016 19:38:07
Does the book that Paul puts out help interpret graphs and whats out of range and why it maybe that way.


Definitely! Also his premium channel is a 'must have'....
Belgium, Europe
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Tyler said Jul 10, 2016 19:48:34
Hey Josh, welcome! Paul's book does include information about using scan data during fuel trim diagnostics, as well as using scam data for pinpoint circuit tests. Check out chapters four and five, good stuff in there.

Your VW appears to be using an upstream air/fuel ratio sensor, AKA a wide band sensor, and a standard zirconia sensor downstream. It looks like you did a throttle snap, then saw the lean reactions of both sensors as the engine speed came back down.

It'd be great if we could get a data capture that included the fuel trims as well as the O2 sensors, engine speed and load. This would give us a much better idea of how the fuel trims are changing, which can really help us point you in the right direction for a fix.

Once you get the data, you can post more images OR find the data file itself and send it to me, and I can view it directly. wrenchturnsyou@gmail.com. There's also ScanShare.io, which enables sharing of Snap-On data files.

It'd also be worth checking the freeze frame data, to get a better idea of when the lean condition occurred. Again, this can really help with finding a diagnostic direction.
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Josh R said Jul 10, 2016 20:16:43
Tyler,
I don't have wifi where I work on my car. I went ahead and bought a ebook and will begin reading it. I will also be purchasing the paper back book as I feel its good to have a physical copy.

My scanner does not have the option for fuel trims for this vehicle for some reason. (it maybe called something else that i do not recognize.) I went ahead and took video and will be uploading it to your email.

Thanks for you help and patience teaching me. I love learning and this is a great education which will go way beyond vehicles in application.
Josh

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cheryl hartkorn said Jul 10, 2016 20:22:00
what does global obd 2 say for long term and short term fuel trim? since you said there isn't an option on your scanner in the vw software. like tyler said what does the trims read at idle and under load?
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Josh R said Jul 10, 2016 20:22:47
Give me 20 minutes to go retrieve that information.
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Josh R said Jul 10, 2016 20:26:09
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cheryl hartkorn said Jul 10, 2016 20:28:37
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Tyler said Jul 10, 2016 20:38:19
I don't have wifi where I work on my car.


Oh yeah, that's OK, you can't use it to transfer data off the scanner anyway. Snappy missed an opportunity there :-(

To move files off the scanner, you have to use a USB cable and put the scanner in Connect-To-PC mode, found under the Tools button. You can also use ShopStream Connect on the PC to view files you've captured. Good software to have if you end up collecting files/captures/waveforms.

I went ahead and bought a ebook and will begin reading it. I will also be purchasing the paper back book as I feel its good to have a physical copy.


Nice! I think you'll like it, ebook or physical.

My scanner does not have the option for fuel trims for this vehicle for some reason. (it maybe called something else that i do not recognize.) I went ahead and took video and will be uploading it to your email.


Cool, I'll keep an eye out. On the manufacturer data, it might call fuel trim Lambda Controller or O2 Integrator. Something along those lines. Like Cheryl suggested, it may be easier to use Global OBD and get the data in plain english.

Thanks for you help and patience teaching me. I love learning and this is a great education which will go way beyond vehicles in application.
Josh


No problem!
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Josh R said Jul 10, 2016 20:41:12
The fuel trim is being up loaded the long term was negative 1.4. I only snapped the throttle and let it accelerated but never drove the vehicle.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpKrk0I8URyaTViSEZmYVFPbUkTHe link to the fuel trim video
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Josh R said Jul 10, 2016 23:47:13
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpKrk0I8URyejcwNy1wWVBkTnM

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxpKrk0I8URyNk5JMGRyY3JPSDA

Just a bit more information. I believe it is a bad O2 Sensor bank 1 sensor 1, but not confident as from what I've read in the book so far it maybe the mass air flow. I'm having a difficult time determining which one it is definitively. Not wanting to be a parts changer I'm asking for guidance.
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Tyler said Jul 11, 2016 01:02:38
Wow Josh, thanks for the videos! Watching the data change in real time helps a ton.

To be honest, I'm not seeing a lean condition so far. Really, your fuel trims have been pretty great, at idle and and while driving. I suspect that there may be an intermittent issue, or the lean condition may only be happening under more load. This is where freeze frame may help.

With your fuel trims looking the way they do, I'd be tempted to clear the code and see if/when it comes back. The code setting again will give you fresh freeze frame data to work with.
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Josh R said Jul 12, 2016 15:32:34
Went ahead and followed your guidance, erasing the codes. After about a hundred miles of driving the mil came on again with the single same code of 17544 or P1136. I did not have the scanner on the vehicle and did not get a freeze frame of the information. Due to lack of knowledge i don't know where to go on the solus to find the freeze frame if one was captured at the time the code was set. Any and all help is great, I'm enjoying the learning process.
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Tyler said Jul 12, 2016 17:23:08
Ahhhhh ok, so it does seem to be intermittent, then. Making progress!

No worries about the freeze frame, it's somewhat hidden from the OEM side. Go into Global OBD (not the OEM side), get to the menu for codes/data, there'll also be an option for freeze frame. It'll show baseline info like engine speed and fuel trims.

The lean code with no O2 circuit codes makes me wonder about an intermittently sticking purge valve, but I may be way off there. We'll find out!
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Josh R said Jul 12, 2016 17:29:12
You think it may be a pcv valve? I'll hook up the scanner this evening and update as follows. Thank you for all your help. Maybe you Paul and a couple others can offer an interactive session with purchase of the book or scanner Danner premium
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Tyler said Jul 12, 2016 17:35:44
I'm not sure about the PCV valve, but only because I'm not familiar with the system design on this engine off the top of my head. If it has an actual plunger valve, then it's absolutely possible.
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